derien | (no subject)

I felt very outgrouped at work today and yesterday, more than I have in a while. Usually we all manage to keep away from topics we don't agree on. But when you are finding a common understanding with someone on a touchy topic, it's tempting to talk about it, and it's easy to forget that another person in the area might really disagree with you. Yesterday I was having quite an interesting conversation with IJ about a show she saw the other day on homosexuality. The way she portrayed it, this show said that basically homosexuality was quite common and accepted even up to mideval times, but that the Catholic church started worrying that humans might die out because they weren't having enough kids. I was kind of like "hm," but anyway we weren't in any major disagreement - it was kind of a peculiar but interesting conversation. And then this other guy we were working with (NV) sort of stepped into the conversation and said homosexuality doesn't exist in nature because it would cause an animal species to not produce enough offspring.

So I of course said, "But that's not so. Homosexual behavior does happen in nature. And the newer research is showing that In animals which form male-female bonded pairs there are also examples of same-sex bonded pairs."

Although I don't think I was able to get through anything like that long a sentance without him inturrupting me several times to say "No! No! Does't happen!" Eventually he said, "Prove it! Show me this research!" He seemed quite upset.

So I said, "Okay, I can do that."

And he said, "Okay. End of discussion."

So, I have to find something. Although it's not going to change his mind, and if I come up with something and give it to him he's just going to think I'm being argumentative, so maybe I shouldn't. But I said I could, so I should. *sigh*

Then today I just ended up spending the day with 3 (and at one point 4) conservatives, and at different points they'd just get going on about how they liked to listen to Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Laura. I just felt like the freak. I guess it was too soon after the incident yesterday.

I was so tired of feeling like the freak that I got Casper the Ghostman to give me a ride home. He's a good guy - I basically told him to take me home, and he very kindly did so, even though he really doesn't know the roads and had to go all the way back to the airport in order to find his way home. It made me feel much better, though - spend five minutes in Casper's company and you don't feel like the freak anymore. ;) He's such a nut - very amusing.:)

Let's see, what else. Oh, I already told

jimdes so I probably don't need to post it here, but CG, EB (soon to be back to her maiden name, so she'll be EG) and NV are getting an apartment together. TSA House! Everyone's trying to get them to get a webcam for their livingroom.;) "Uncle" K (a manager) gives it 3 months before he expects they'll be driving to work seperately. CG wanted

eor and myself to get in on this, too, as well as PB - he thought then we'd be able to afford to rent an actual house. I said to PB this would be like the Ghostbusters, since she's read my "Just One Kiss" story. She quailed.

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Biological Exuberance, if you're looking for evidence. It's somewhat out-of-date, and I never got all the way through it, but it's big.

I despise Dr. Laura with all my heart. I was flipping through her "Care and Feeding of the Wild-Caught Husband" book (or whatever it's called) the other day, and ARGH! Apparently a woman's dues in marriage are sex. She gives husband sex (because women apparently don't have sex drives except as an extension of their husband's) in exchange for him working. Basically wife = prostitute. And it's mean to expect men to cuddle, because heaven forbid they get turned on and NOT immediately shag. Men don't like cuddling, only sex! I HATE that woman, and am very glad the men I get involved with are not men who live in her world. For that matter, I'm glad I'm not a woman in her world.

I sympathize with your pain.

Oh dear me. One really has to wonder if Dr. Laura has some kind of problem with her sex drive. And I've heard men state that getting turned on and not shagging can actually be fun, too. Let's just set the advancement of equality back at least to Victorian times. The woman is cracked.

Yes, I have also been told by more than one man that they enjoy cuddling. But I guess Dr. Laura would say they've been brainwashed by all these horrid modern women.

And of course, it's inconceivable that I'd want to shag unprompted!

Let's just set the advancement of equality back at least to Victorian times.

That's the idea, I think.

There's a whole book on the topic, called Biological Exuberance, by Bruce Bagemihl. I haven’t read it yet, but

docorion gave it to me when he moved to Hawai‘i. Let me know if you’re going to be in Boston soon and you’d like to borrow it.

Unfortunately, I just a couple of days ago deleted a message to a list I’m on that had a fair amount of information on same-sex mating attempts in birds.

Googling for “homosexual animals” produced a bunch of relevant-looking links, including a Salon article at http://www.salon.com/it/feature/1999/03/cov_15featurea.html that seems to borrow heavily from Bagemihl’s book. (I didn’t read the whole thing.)

I hardly ever get down there, so if I did borrow the book it would take me forever to get it back to you - but thanks for the offer.:) Perhaps interlibrary loan would be the way to go.

I'll look up the article, thanks.:)

Do a search on the famous "Lesbian Seagulls." It's very informative.

Oh, and not all us conservatives like to listen to Rush, Ann Coulter or Michael Savage. Some of us happen to think those guys are boobs. (I will admit to a teeny crush on Michael Medved, Movie Critic Extraordinare, but that's just his voice. He's actually quite the non-looker. Hence the career in radio...)

(I will admit to a teeny crush on Michael Medved, Movie Critic Extraordinare, but that's just his voice. He's actually quite the non-looker. Hence the career in radio...)

You ever hear that phrase "s/he has a face (or body) for radio"?

The whole weird thing about how I felt yesterday is that I actually _like_ the guys I was working with and get along really well with them, normally, it's just how the conversation went with the bunch of them, I just felt totally like I didn't belong. And maybe it was too soon after the event of the day before, which... that guy tends to be so intense.

"Lesbian Seagulls" - I'll search on it, thanks.:)

heck, phone up New York City's Central Park Zoo and ask them about the gay chinstrap penguins:

New York flips as penguins come out in Central Park

Robin McKie, science editor
Sunday February 8, 2004
The Observer

As gays go, Roy and Silo are not unusual. They cohabit, are affectionate in public and have been inseparable for years. Only their species marks them out. The New York pair are chinstrap penguins.
Every day at Manhattan's Central Park Zoo the two males entwine necks, vocalise to each other and have, er, sex. When offered female companionship, they decline.

Roy and Silo have even displayed urges to procreate, and once tried to hatch a rock. Finally their keeper, Rob Gramzay, gave them a fertile egg from another brood. Tango, their chick, was born later. The pair raised it lovingly. 'They did a great job,' admits Gramzay...

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